I would have a get together but my house is pretty shitty with bad layouts for listening. If i ever get my shit together and organize/declutter the abundance of hobby crap laying around my house it could do it haha
Programming a cut in CNC is a three step process for me.
1. Draw the 2d model in sketchup 2. Import into vcarve, to do the toolpath, I use vectric aspire, that's what they have at the workshop, very similar to vcarve. 3. Import the toolpath into Mach3 and set the zero x, y, z and let her rip.
Z plate requires small input in Mach 3. CNCRP will send it to you if it's not on their website already. Be careful with returning spindle (router) to 0 point. If the bit is cutting and for some reason you stopped the G-code and send it home, Mach 3 will not raise the tool to safe Z (out of the work piece) but rather just send it flying through the material as it weren't there. You have to raise the tool manually. What is this edge-finder you got?
Its their new one. It has the code at the bottom of the page. I bought instead of bill griggs (the makersguide) triple edge finder. Its a little more but i like thw safety margin of cncrps spring loaded interface.
When i checked out the joes machines in michigan they had the triple edge finder and he turned off the c9ntrol box to show us them turned the machine back on to setup a cut. For some reason when he tried to set the height it didnt do it correct and pushed the "V" bit into the aluminum 3edge finder and bent the tip so it wasnt a point anymore. It was his fault it did it but he couldnt stop it fast enough.
Its a cool little tool that finds the exact 90 deg corner for you and the z height with one script. So if your machines powers off or a bit breaks you can start over exactly were u did before even if you move the work piece you can set it again.
I tried the touch plate a couple of times, but now I just use Ctrl+> to lower till the bit just touched the workpiece. If you rotate the bit by hand, the edges just leave a faint circle. If the bit digs in and doesn't turn, it is too low. Works fine for me.
Mike, let me know when you get it all dialed in and I'll send you some work.
Will do. Hope to get it moved into position this weekend. My dads been out of town and i need his truck to go get a few sheets of mdf and get this thing into location. Hopefully a few more weeks and ill be up and going.
Ill have questions. I havent had alot of free time to work on the cnc anymore. Been working a little overtime to pay for all this shit. Still working on the spoil board drawing. The Fusion360 program really pisses me off. The spoil board drawing they provide with the machine have dimensions that dont line up to my rails for the mounting hardware so i just starting trying to draw my own up. Its a good process to take i guess so i can learn how to use the machine. I just want to get cutting. It just keeps flashing constantly when you move around and stuff. I just ordered kents dust shoe and the tramming jig with the 2 dial indicators. The machine instructions for assembly were okay but what to do afterwards is not great. They skip over some key information in the videos on selecting bits and generating toolpaths.
I might get to work on it this weekend for a few hours. Im trying to get a bunch of drawings together so when i have time to go out there i can knock our a bunch of stuff.
What does your spoil board look like Roman? You like t-track or dog holes or 1/4-20 inserts? What bits are you using for the folding miter joints?
I haven't worked in Fusion 360. I know many people do so I am going to guess it's inexperience on your part. That's normal. Some of this software packages are not intuitive at all. Like Sound Easy. LOL You will have to measure your rails and create digital representation of physical construct. That's the only way you can do it. Basic algorithm is this. You have your 2D or 3D modeler. You build your surface or set of curves to be cut or a 3D object. Next, you have G-code generator. G-Code generator tells your router how fast to move, and the coordinates. RhinoCam is the one I use. The last piece of software is Mach3 which interprets G-code and sends digital packets to controllers which in tune translate that in to electrical pulses to the motors.
I'll post a picture of my spoil-board but basically it looks like it's been cut 10 000 times. I resurface spoil-board twice year and then change it. I screw my stock directly to the spoil-board. Folding miter, I cut on the table saw. You can use large 45 degree bit but I never found the need for it. It comes down to other tools you have.If you want to do folding miters on CNC, you have to have flat spoil-board, and flattened (by means of vacuum or screws) piece of MDF, Plywood or whatever other material you machining. 718-207-3030 if you need practical advise. 10 to 7 NY time.
Im getting close now. I tried for a few more hours on fusion but I started using vcarve and I really like the program. I Designed a new spoil board it has the t-track slots and mounting hardware on it. I will recess the track hardware and then put another layer on top so it will be 1.5" thick. Then the track will be under the other spoil board and I can cut the dog holes in through that. I think this will be better so I can potentially trim the spoilboard down until nothing then just replace it. Also, it will help with rigidity. The base isn't all it's cracked up to be. I think a boxed heavy duty wood base would have been just as good possibly better.
Here is the spoil board (I will be removing some dog holes because machine time is like 4 hours @ 100ipm with 1/4 DC spiral bit) on the spoil board. Plus a set of baffles I've been wanting for some time lol.
First operation you running is pocketing. I would run the first step as profiling and machine out cylinders in the centers. You are removing all the material while really, you just need to cut it out and not turn the whole thing in to dust and dull the bit. It should take under 5 min per two speakers. Set you feed rate to 150 ipm for circular curt and depth of cut per step to 0.15", 15000rpm. I am assuming 1/4" downcut spiral bit from your description. Leave either tabs or onion skin so the cylinders don't fly out. Same for the tweeters. After this operation is finished, pause the router and remove the pucks. Next, run your pockets for tweeter and woofer frames. I'd use the same 150 ipm at 15000rpm Last, run the outside profiles. Keep the rpm but increase the feed to 250ipm.
The base isnt not really adjustable you just have decent leveling feet. Its not as ridgid as i would have liked. Its decent but i think im going to use wood to stiffen up and join some of the legs together.
Whats the procedure for the onion skin method? I was going to set my cutter the top of the work piece for pockets and then set it to the top of the extrusion frame (just a hair above) then zero the z-axis then manually type in -0.75 because thats my nominal thickness. Would typing in -0.76 leave the 0.010 material left?
Not sure what you mean by the second paragraph, but onion skin is leaving a very think material. So for the driver holes, assuming you are using 3/4 inch mdf, you would select the cut-out and set profile cut depth to 0.74, leaving 0.01" of material as the onion skin. Assuming you are using 1/4" bit, this will leave a channel 1/4 wide and 0.74" deep. then you punch out the center block and flush trip the left over skin. the other alternative is use tabs and then break them to free the center block and flush trim the tab ends.
This explains it better. Its so you dont cut into your spoil board. My mdf and plywood is never 0.750" its usually 0.70-0.73" so it will always cut too far if u use the 0.75 thickness. This way i dont have to measure the exact thickness i just need to rezero the bit on tbrough cutz
The BB ply I use is less than 0.75" but mdf always seem to be 0.75
The video explanation is good, but I suggest not to fret too much over the spoilboard for now, and just assume it is going to get spoilt. I have gotten to the point where I would not go over 0.01" - 0.02" into the spoilboard. Earlier, I used to set the cut depth much deeper. as you keep using the machine, you will get a better feel for what works and what doesn't - especially when to use downcut vs upcut. The rules of thumb are there, but. For eg, i use down cut for hardwood baffles to minimize tearout on the good side, but use the up cut bit if they are mdf baffles, as the tear out on mdf is not bad and gets smoothen with some sanding - but not so for hard wood. But using up cut bit makes it much easier to cut and the dust collection is more effective as the bit is not trying to pack everything between the spoilboard and the work piece. I also used to burn mdf by using downcut bits for peck drilling, now i change bits based on what i am doing and try to arrange the tool paths to minimise bit changes as well as tear out and dust collection. For small tweeter holes and ports, i will just do pocket cuts instead of profile cuts, etc. There are also tradeoffs between how good the end results are vs setup and cut time. Hard woods I would use relatively newer bits, mdf some old dull bits will still do. Plywood is another pain as they always require a lot of sanding on the tear out side, regardless of which bit you use.
Kent dust shoe came tonight! What a nice piece! Kind of scary tightening it. $160 is a little steep but i like the idea of being able to look at the bit cutting.
One thing to look out for with dust shoes. You see how it can be mounted higher or lower on the spindle. So, if you cutting, say 3/4" you want the bristles of the brush to rub against the stock so you get good seal and dust is sucked out. Ones you going to a thicker stock or a high 3D part, brush may get knocked off from the shoe and it'll get chewed up by the spindle. So, just keep an eye on the relative height of the shoe on the spindle. Bring it down lower for thin stock and higher for thick stock or 3D parts. Always measure your panel with the caliper. Even an inexpensive digital caliper is a must. There's no such thing as .75 from the machining standpoint of view. I cut in to my spoil-board as well.
I did some research and that toolpath time function is not the most accurate. I need to change the IPM to 150 instead of 100 and i can try to set the factor to 1 instead of 2 (the video said that factor increase the estimated time by that number) so its likely to be alot faster than it says. Especially if i fix my toolpaths to get profiles instead of the pockets.
On a side note carbide create is now free 2d cad/cam software.
Comments
1. Draw the 2d model in sketchup
2. Import into vcarve, to do the toolpath, I use vectric aspire, that's what they have at the workshop, very similar to vcarve.
3. Import the toolpath into Mach3 and set the zero x, y, z and let her rip.
I'll look for a video and add more details.
It's a 3D model/toolpath generator/Mach3
I think it's pretty universal.
Be careful with returning spindle (router) to 0 point. If the bit is cutting and for some reason you stopped the G-code and send it home, Mach 3 will not raise the tool to safe Z (out of the work piece) but rather just send it flying through the material as it weren't there. You have to raise the tool manually.
What is this edge-finder you got?
When i checked out the joes machines in michigan they had the triple edge finder and he turned off the c9ntrol box to show us them turned the machine back on to setup a cut. For some reason when he tried to set the height it didnt do it correct and pushed the "V" bit into the aluminum 3edge finder and bent the tip so it wasnt a point anymore. It was his fault it did it but he couldnt stop it fast enough.
http://www.cncrouterparts.com/auto-z-and-corner-finding-touch-plate-p-288.html
I have just a regular Z touch plate.
https://www.millrightcnc.com/product-page/pre-order-millright-cnc-carve-king-kit
The price is coming down on the smaller units.
Posted this on PE.
Will be happy to answer all the questions.
Ill have questions. I havent had alot of free time to work on the cnc anymore. Been working a little overtime to pay for all this shit. Still working on the spoil board drawing. The Fusion360 program really pisses me off. The spoil board drawing they provide with the machine have dimensions that dont line up to my rails for the mounting hardware so i just starting trying to draw my own up. Its a good process to take i guess so i can learn how to use the machine. I just want to get cutting. It just keeps flashing constantly when you move around and stuff. I just ordered kents dust shoe and the tramming jig with the 2 dial indicators. The machine instructions for assembly were okay but what to do afterwards is not great. They skip over some key information in the videos on selecting bits and generating toolpaths.
I might get to work on it this weekend for a few hours. Im trying to get a bunch of drawings together so when i have time to go out there i can knock our a bunch of stuff.
What does your spoil board look like Roman? You like t-track or dog holes or 1/4-20 inserts? What bits are you using for the folding miter joints?
You will have to measure your rails and create digital representation of physical construct. That's the only way you can do it.
Basic algorithm is this.
You have your 2D or 3D modeler. You build your surface or set of curves to be cut or a 3D object.
Next, you have G-code generator. G-Code generator tells your router how fast to move, and the coordinates. RhinoCam is the one I use.
The last piece of software is Mach3 which interprets G-code and sends digital packets to controllers which in tune translate that in to electrical pulses to the motors.
I'll post a picture of my spoil-board but basically it looks like it's been cut 10 000 times. I resurface spoil-board twice year and then change it. I screw my stock directly to the spoil-board.
Folding miter, I cut on the table saw. You can use large 45 degree bit but I never found the need for it. It comes down to other tools you have.If you want to do folding miters on CNC, you have to have flat spoil-board, and flattened (by means of vacuum or screws) piece of MDF, Plywood or whatever other material you machining.
718-207-3030 if you need practical advise. 10 to 7 NY time.
Here is the spoil board (I will be removing some dog holes because machine time is like 4 hours @ 100ipm with 1/4 DC spiral bit) on the spoil board. Plus a set of baffles I've been wanting for some time lol.
After this operation is finished, pause the router and remove the pucks.
Next, run your pockets for tweeter and woofer frames. I'd use the same 150 ipm at 15000rpm
Last, run the outside profiles. Keep the rpm but increase the feed to 250ipm.
Whats the procedure for the onion skin method? I was going to set my cutter the top of the work piece for pockets and then set it to the top of the extrusion frame (just a hair above) then zero the z-axis then manually type in -0.75 because thats my nominal thickness. Would typing in -0.76 leave the 0.010 material left?
The video explanation is good, but I suggest not to fret too much over the spoilboard for now, and just assume it is going to get spoilt. I have gotten to the point where I would not go over 0.01" - 0.02" into the spoilboard. Earlier, I used to set the cut depth much deeper. as you keep using the machine, you will get a better feel for what works and what doesn't - especially when to use downcut vs upcut. The rules of thumb are there, but. For eg, i use down cut for hardwood baffles to minimize tearout on the good side, but use the up cut bit if they are mdf baffles, as the tear out on mdf is not bad and gets smoothen with some sanding - but not so for hard wood. But using up cut bit makes it much easier to cut and the dust collection is more effective as the bit is not trying to pack everything between the spoilboard and the work piece. I also used to burn mdf by using downcut bits for peck drilling, now i change bits based on what i am doing and try to arrange the tool paths to minimise bit changes as well as tear out and dust collection. For small tweeter holes and ports, i will just do pocket cuts instead of profile cuts, etc. There are also tradeoffs between how good the end results are vs setup and cut time. Hard woods I would use relatively newer bits, mdf some old dull bits will still do. Plywood is another pain as they always require a lot of sanding on the tear out side, regardless of which bit you use.
So, just keep an eye on the relative height of the shoe on the spindle. Bring it down lower for thin stock and higher for thick stock or 3D parts.
Always measure your panel with the caliper. Even an inexpensive digital caliper is a must.
There's no such thing as .75 from the machining standpoint of view.
I cut in to my spoil-board as well.
On a side note carbide create is now free 2d cad/cam software.
http://carbide3d.com/carbidecreate/